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"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic."

- Obi-Wan Kenobi, A New Hope

Remember when Obi-Wan first said that simple, but explanatory quote back in the first Star Wars movie? Remember hearing him talk about the lightsaber as an elegant weapon for a more civilized age as Luke activated and waved around his father's lightsaber? Remember Luke's training on Dagobah and listening to Master Yoda talk about the jedi philosophy and the force? Remember when Luke first appeared in Return of the Jedi as a jedi in all but formality? Remember your chills when you recalled that Darth Vader had been a cunning, noble and loyal jedi knight before falling to the dark side?

We were given a short glimpse into what the jedi order once was. It flared our imaginations and gave birth to the mock lightsaber fight. We loved lightsabers, we loved the robes and we loved the mythical and almost spiritual power that jedi wielded. We were also curious about how this order operated? How did it protect the republic? How did it fall?

Then Prequels came out...

We saw a lot of lightsabers, people in robes, jedi in all shapes and sizes, and in many capacities. We also saw that they weren't quite so perfect and were liable to making mistakes. This isn't a problem by itself, but one time too many...these mistakes, some of which were painfully easy to avoid, caught us piecing together a simple sentence in our minds:

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

That was a near exact quote from internet reviewer ConfusedMatthew. While many shun him for hating the Lion King and I felt he was too harsh on Simba myself, I think he was on to something when talking about the Prequels.

There are too many moments in the Prequel Era or the Expanded Universe where the Jedi Order act as something other than the noble protectors that they're supposed to be. Now, there are good people in the order like Revan, Jolee, Lord Hoth, Obi-Wan, Yoda, Mace, Plo Koon, Kit Fisto and Ahsoka and the code itself is good. But the practices of the Old Republic jedi just seem heartless at worst and machine-like at best.

I am not saying that Sith aren't evil or that Jedi are the real bad guys.

This isn't to say that the evil that the sith perpetrate isn't evil. They are the bad guys of the series. They manipulate, scheme and murder without remorse or regret (mostly) and have ignited terrible conflicts that always result in the deaths of millions if not billions of people. Some sith even get off on the carnage they cause, their power feeds on despair, hopelessness and etc.

I just don't think that the jedi of the Old Republic really live up to Obi-Wan's description. Despite the whole "Certain Point of View" thing, Obi-Wan wouldn't have lied to Luke about who the jedi knights were. But imagine Luke's shock when he pieces together the history of the jedi and discovers exactly what his order was following on the footsteps of. Though to be fair that history lesson may have served the New Jedi Order much better in the long run.

We'll start with the films.

In Episode 1, it is shown that there are places in the galaxy that have slavery and even have a booming trade centered around this. It would be understandable for the jedi to be unactive in those areas since the systems involved likely weren't members of the Republic. I can also see why Qui-Gon Jinn only freed Anakin and didn't try harder for his mom, he was in a hurry to save Naboo.

But after Episode 1, not only does Anakin never see his mother until she dies in Episode 2, but the jedi never sent someone back to that planet to buy/free her. Despite knowing that Anakin would feel fear for his mother's safety, they never lift a finger to help despite the rational benefit of allowing Anakin's training to progress with a more at ease mind. Not one that is constantly building up fear and distrust with the jedi order and eventually led to him becoming darth vader a few short years after his mother's death.

What would have been so bad about freeing Anakin's mom? Why couldn't they free her and then make it clear to Anakin that he could only have limited contact due to his duties as a jedi? Did they really have to leave him in the dark to resent the jedi and fear for his mother?

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Then...we have the issue of Anakin's age in Episode One. Despite Anakin's unprecedented force potential and being the fulfillment of an ancient prophecy about balance...the jedi initially refuse to train him.

Why? Is it because he's too reckless? Is it because he has no patience? Is it because he has too much fear?

Nope, he's too old.




Remember that he's 9 years old.

I could understand why Yoda said those same words to Luke in Empire Strikes Back. Luke was 22/23 when he came to Yoda and the old master only accepted because Luke was the last hope for the jedi order and the galaxy.

Here...what's wrong with a 9 year old?

The answer comes from expanded universe information that states that the majority of jedi began their training as infants. They were tested for force sensitivity, confirmed, taken away from their parents with Republic permission and brainwashed from that time on.

How can a jedi truly understand what it means to be a jedi...if they know nothing else about themselves?

So the jedi have no problems with borderline kidnapping or brainwashing/indoctrinating children from the age of 0? But...a 9 old boy with a high force potential is too old...

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

The issue that I have that makes the jedi moral compass much more subject is Episode 2.
The film opens up with a Seperatist crisis where thousands of star systems are leaving the Republic. Then we see Palpatine talking to the Jedi Masters about negotiations and the Jedi are trying to advice Palpatine that they can't fight the separatists if it comes down to a war.

Hold on...aren't jedi supposed to be mediators? Shouldn't the jedi be sending ambassadors over to the separatists and as a whole act as a go-between for the two sides? Remember that we don't know that the separatists intend for war until the last fourth of the movie. So the jedi are unanimously siding with the republic without giving any consideration as to why all of these star systems are leaving. What kind of signal does this send to the opposition when the jedi side with the corrupt Republic without even coming to talk to you about why you're leaving?

Isn't that an implied message of, "If you leave the republic then you're ass is grass?"

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Eventually, it does come and the jedi become generals of an illegally made, shaddily funded and oddly sanctioned army of clones who have only been bred and told their whole life that their only purpose is to obey, fight and die! The jedi never have any qualms about this army. They are perfectly content to have these pseudo-slaves die in the millions when the man that they should be fighting is sitting in broad daylight on their capital planet!

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Believe it or not...things get worst.

I understand that war brings out the best and worst in people...but there's something wrong with this next sentence.

In the Clone Wars Movie, the Jedi Order forms an alliance with Jabba the Hutt so that republic vessels can safely travel through Hutt controlled space.

So...despite having an army of cloned mandalorian badasses led by thousands of jedi knights who can lift tanks with their minds...the jedi order forms an alliance with Jabba the Hutt.

So...the space within Hutt-controlled systems are so essential, that the noble warriors of wisdom will willingly work with a known and infamous despotic gang lord. An overgrown slug whose enterprise is built on top of the capture and selling of sentient beings, gambling, the smuggling of illegal materials and spices, paid murder, furthering corruption, greed, and stained with the blood of countless millions of people.


"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!" gets worst

Sometime into the war, someone puts out a threat on the Chancellor and it's a race against time to find whoever's behind the plot.

So how do the jedi decide to do this? By having Obi-Wan fake his own death so that they can alter his appearance to look like a bounty hunter. Then Obi-Wan break out Cad Bane so that Bane can lead him to this assembly of bounty hunters who Count Dooku is testing for an upcoming job. Then Obi-Wan finds out about the job, relies the information to Yoda and the Council and coordinates with them to thwart Dooku's plan.

That's actually a good plan...

Except that they didn't tell Anakin about it and Anakin almost killed Obi-Wan.

That's smart...Anakin is only one of your more emotionally conflicted jedi's perfectly logical to leave him out of the loop because of his attachment to his former master and sworn brother. It's not like Obi-Wan could've assured Anakin that he'd be alright and Anakin couldn't calm down a little bit...

Oh wait! That's exactly what could've happened!

In short, the jedi were so paranoid about Anakin's attachment issues and genuine care for his friends that they left him out of the loop. In doing so, they nearly screwed up their own plan and would've been responsible for the death of a one of their own members if Obi-Wan didn't talk Anakin down!

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

It gets worse...

Eventually Darth Maul comes back and takes Savage Opress under his wing. They carve a scythe of terror through the outer rim and even kill a bunch of jedi. Obi Wan and Adi Gallia find them on Florium trying to recruit pirates and Gallia is killed during the battle. It seems like Maul was killed, but since there's no body, Obi-Wan believes that Maul is still alive somewhere in the outer rim.

The response of Yoda?

"A personal matter for you, this is."




Okay...I'll admit that Yoda has a point. Maul did kill Obi-Wan's master and murdered a whole village just to lure him out. So maybe Obi-Wan is taking the search for Maul a little too personally.

On the other hand...SHUT UP!

Yoda...what is Maul's full name? Darth Maul. DARTH...MAUL...He is a Dark Lord of the Sith who is an accomplice for an unprovoked invasion and has murdered at least 3 jedi. This Maul is also working with a known dark jedi who has also killed many jedi including a member of the Jedi Council.

These are the last two people that the jedi should dismiss as irrelevant. But that's exactly what the jedi do. They dismiss Maul for dead without even sending a pair of jedi out just to be safe. Remember that the Sith are the sworn enemies of the jedi and Maul is the first sith to had been seen in nearly a thousand years.

Maybe you guys would want to capture Maul? Question him about the other sith? You know...the one who you know is somehow influencing the Senate?

Nah! We've got a war to fight! What's the worst that a legitimate Sith Lord could do in the Outer Rim?

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Wonder what becomes of the Jedi's decision?

Well...Maul meets up with a splinter Mandolorian group called Death Watch, gathers a collective of warriors, bounty hunters, crime families and even Jabba the Hutt himself (big surprise) and single-handedly takes over Mandalore in a mostly bloodless coup. Duchess Satine is imprisoned and briefly escapes long enough to send out a message to the Jedi calling for help.

The Jedi basically tell her to go f$#@ herself.

Why? Because Mandalore is a neutral world and Death Watch is no longer affiliated with the Separatists so the Republic can't authorize an expedition. If Obi-Wan wants to help Satine, he'll have to go alone. I'm sure that he'll be alright, he'll take that bounty hunter armor from when everyone thought he was dead and burrow Anakin's ship, the Twilight. I mean what's the worst that could possibly happen...

(The Twilight is blown up; Satine is choked and stabbed by Maul; she then dies in Obi-Wan's arms; And Mandalore effectively remains under the control of the Sith.)

So...the guardians of peace and justice refuse a call for help because the planet making the call is neutral...A sovereign state is appealing to you for helping while under assault by crime lords and blood-thirsty mandalorians and the jedi say no. They didn't even send anyone with Obi-Wan...they just let him go by himself and that's it.

So...the jedi can take force sensitive infants from any world whether that world is part of the republic or not...but if that world is under attack and it calls to the jedi for help...the jedi can say no without it being a breach in their code...

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"


Episode 3 comes around and now...the jedi just seem like idiots.

Short recap, Anakin and Obi-Wan saved the Chancellor and safely landed a heavily damaged dreadnought after Anakin defeated and killed Count Dooku. Palpatine appoints Anakin as his personal representative on the Jedi Council and the Jedi allow the appointment, but they don't grant Anakin the rank of master.


I know that Anakin isn't perfect, but considering the track record of the Jedi Order...they're the last guys who should be pointing fingers. Besides, hasn't the kid more than proved himself by training a padawan and defeating a sith lord who was originally one of the most talented and powerful jedi masters in recent history? Would be so wrong to grant him the title of Master?

Apparently yes.

Based on the following conversation, the Jedi don't like that Palpatine is meddling in Jedi Affairs and want Anakin to act as a spy. denied Anakin the rank of Master as a take-that to Palpatine for overstepping his bounds and then they want this same Anakin to spy on Palpatine? Doesn't denying him a reasonable promotion just make him more antagonistic towards you guys and less likely to trust you when you ask him to spy on the leader of the Republic?

So...forming alliances with crime bosses, ignoring blatant threats to galactic security, denying the pleas of a sovereign government under fire, child brainwashing, and leading a cloned slave army are not at all breaches in the Jedi Code. So why would denial of promotion be a problem?

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Then there's the whole Palpatine infiltration thing. I've never understood why thousands and thousands of jedi couldn't sense Palpatine until it was too late or didn't act until it was too late. You expect me to believe that this guy has been in the public highlight over ten years and the Jedi were never at least suspicious of him?

Yoda is nearly 900 years old, but he couldn't sense anything from the guy sitting in front of him?

Yes, there's such a thing as Force Stealth.  But this is just pushing it. Palpatine was really able to hide under the noses of the Jedi Order when his capital building is within sight of the Jedi Order's Headquarters?

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

The above is a minor point up until we find out that the Jedi have sensed something about Palpatine.

"I sense a plot to destroy the Jedi, the dark side surrounds the Chancellor."

Then what are you waiting for?

Just prove that Palpatine doesn't have the people's best interest at heart and convince them to dethrone Palpatine. I know that the emergency powers gave him a lot of power, but that doesn't change the fact that Palpatine's grand plan could have been averted by the most basic amount of common sense.

Why didn't the Jedi do any of the following:

1) Relay this information to a Jedi-sympathetic Senator like Bail Organa, Mon Mothma or Padme and have them declare a vote of no confidence in the Chancellor?

2) Give him a lie detector test and have a jedi search his feelings. If Palpatine can block out the jedi then it means that he knows about the force and is force sensitive himself.

3) Check his midi-chlorian count. If Palpatine refuses, then it means that he's hiding something. If he accepts, then bingo with scientific proof.

4) Execute Order 65. When Anakin comes back and tells Mace that Palpatine is a Sith Lord, why doesn't Mace immediately relay this information to any nearby clone commander? They know that sith are enemies of the republic and if Palpatine is a sith then he must be detained or killed. Turn Palpatine's greatest asset against him.

5) Confront him in public. Instead of trying to arrest Palpatine in his office where you're all alone, why not do so in a public place. If Palpatine tries to use his sith abilities then everyone will see and if he doesn't then the jedi can safely apply force resistant cuffs to him or put him in a ray shield.

6) Wear a wire. Why didn't Anakin, Mace or any of the other fodder jedi wear a wire or some kind of camera that records Palpatine's movements? It's a basic technology that earthling's use and the Star Wars universe is a technological paradise. So why would a wire be out of the question?

And if all else fails and Order 66 still happens...why didn't Yoda and Obi-Wan...

7) Relay the damning evidence against Palpatine to the Senate?

Remember that the Jedi Archives contain security recordings on everything that happened in the temple with scenes of a Fallen Anakin killing younglings, killing jedi and bowing before Palpatine in dark robes and being called Darth Vader.

So...what did they do with the recording?

Why didn't Obi-Wan show it to Padme and have Padme show it to her friends and then those friends can show their friends until the majority of the Senate is calling out Palpatine on his bullshit. Remember that in the early stages of his empire, Palpatine still needed the Senate to maintain control of the vast galaxy. If Palpatine tries to repress them with force then they'll turn against him and if he attempts to lie then they'll outright rebel with various no-win uprisings for Palpatine and his army.

But...they don't do that...

If that wasn't possible, then why didn't they at least...

8) Team up together and murder Palpatine?

Remember, that Obi-Wan managed to defeat Anakin who was described as being more powerful than either Palpatine or Yoda and Yoda tied against Palpatine.

So why didn't the two jedi masters team up together and take on each sith at a time?

They could attack Palpatine and kill him then track down Anakin and kill/capture him. The galaxy may still hate the jedi, but at least the Sith are destroyed and the jedi can still rebuild in secret...

Nope! They split up and practically fail...Obi-Wan even leaves Anakin to burn to death with only one limp and doesn't have the common courtesy to give the kid a mercifully quick death?

"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

And as an afternote! How about the whole Ahsoka Trial?

During the recent season finale Star Wars the Clone Wars, someone bombs the Jedi Temple hanger because they don't like that the jedi are leading a war. As a result, Ahsoka and Anakin are assigned to find the bomber while dealing with Tarkin whose favorite hobby is being a complete and utter prick.

But then, they find the bomber and she's force choked to death when Ahsoka goes to visit her. Believing that Ahsoka was the one who force choked the bomber, she's labeled as a fugitive and forced into hiding. Along the way, she's attacked by a masked lightsaber duelist who seems to be Ventress and after fighting for her life, she lands into a storage depot with bombs in it. Then she's captured and interrogated by the jedi.

Now think about this. Ahsoka has no knowledge of how to use the force to choke people as she is a padawan...there are plenty of security cameras that should confirm that Ahsoka didn't kill those clone troopers, not to mention the logs of their own helmets...the timeframe for which Ahsoka would've had to plan and pull off the bombing would've made no sense...and searching her feelings will tell you that she's not lying when she says that she didn't do it.

The Jedi Order kicks her out and sends her to a Republic Kangaroo Court...





So let me get this straight...the Jedi Order...guardians of peace and justice who are intuned with the force...actually thought that there was enough evidence to ban Ahsoka from the Order and let her be put on trial with a possible penalty of death? They really thought that Ahsoka...a war hero and one of the nicest people around...would actually choke someone to death?...They really believe that Ahsoka...a jedi who feels true remorse and regret whenever a clone dies under her command...would just murder several troopers without a second thought? They really believe that of the most steadfast and proactive members of the jedi order...would actually coordinate an attack on the Jedi Temple which has been her home since she was a child?

And they actually kicked her out...

What The Hell Kind of Jedi Are These? Guardians Of Peace And Justice MY ASS!"

I wouldn't be surprised if Ahsoka was muttering the very same thing when she left the Order! I don't blame her and that's just ignoring every other item on this list!

But believe it or not...this is only half of the whole picture.

It gets worst...

Way...F@#$ing Worst....

Continued in Part 2....
First half of my insight into one of the most flawed "heroic" organizations in fiction, the Jedi Order.

Part 2: [link]
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Okay while I do agree with your arguements and even today I see how the sterility and self-indulgence of their power doomed the Jedi order, with that said repeating the whole guardians of peace and justice my ass line is distracting.

I know you're trying to make a point with it but there's a little term called overkill.

Other than that nice job. But next time please don't use the same tagline over and over again to get a point a cross. It makes you look like an ameteur. That's all I have to say about this synopsis of yours.
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Vader999 Featured By Owner May 18, 2014
That's the point of the Jedi near the end: they've been successful for so long they've gotten sloppy. Archaic. Proud.
NordRonnoc Featured By Owner Feb 16, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
"What the hell kind of Jedi are these? Guardians of Peace and Justice my ass!"

Someone should start a drinking contest on this. Take a shot every time you read this phrase. Afterwards, good luck finding a new liver!
Nazena Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2013
Though I'm a huge fan of Star Wars and especially of the (/Lukes) Jedi Order, I have to agree in many points. One of the reasons I prefer Lukes Jedi- they also made terrible decisions and huge mistakes, but at least they admitted it often or said they have to harm or kill few to protect many.
BTW: The Jedi searched for Maul after E1: TPM, in one of the books (I think it was Cloak of Deception). The Jedi wanted to do the right thing, but just as the most politicians (assuming those guys did actually wanted to help the people they represent somewhere in their life and didn't just took the position because they wanted just the power from the very beginning) they were corrupted by power, wealth and time. They were one of the most influential groups during Episode I, if not THE most- as far as I understood it, they did take orders from the senate, but weren't' completely accountable. Who watches the watchmen?
They rules had been so tightly that they basically restrained every single member. The jedi weren't individuals any more. The Jedi council would have preferred as if every jedi would have acted completely emotionless and "calm" ( actually reminded me of insects...). Somewhat during E2 (I guess) Anakins tells Padme that the jedi "were supposed to love". He's smooth-talking, but I guess he's right, something that Luke understands years later. If you don't love somebody or have any kind of emotional attachment, why should you fight at all? Mon Motha also says (in Jedi Academy?) that a jedi who sits on a mountain and meditates is worse for the republic than no jedi at all.
Life tells us that life means evolution and stagnation leads to death. The jedi forgot that change and sometimes death is an essential part of live. The sith had adapted to new situations during their exile, the jedi order basically stayed the same since the battle of Ruusan. It gave my a creepy feeling when I read that before Ruusan the chancellor of the republic had often been a jedi… (Ruusan Reformation)
In the novel of E2 Mace Windu had the opportunity to kill Dooku at the Geonesion arena. In Shatterpoint he thought that he saw the "threads of the Force" at that moment and if he had killed Dooku right there, the war might not have started. But he didn't, because he followed the "no kill" policy of the order (which the jedi seemed to follow if a character death would have been necessary and which they kinda ignored when there would have been another way than to kill someone…).
It's intriguing, though, that many jedi, especially the masters, spoke of "balance in the force", but MEANT that the light side should rule completely and without restraint. They were so convinced by their own integrity that they never overthought their own behavior. Like the money issue- it is easy to live ascetic when you exactly know that there is always someone who will pay the bills for your food, clothes and shelter.
The two great flaws of the jedi - and the sith, and pretty much the most force-users in the GFFA as far as I can say, are pride and arrogance. They never even considered the possibility that they might be wrong or somebody else's way would be the better one.
I personally think that the jedi are some kind of "sacrifice"- of course they sacrifice a lot of things themselves, but their" job" is to take the burden of other people who are not able to help themselves. That's why the force granted them their powers.

These are just my two cents. I'm sorry for orthographic errors; my first language isn't English but German. The quotes are what I memorized without looking it up- I read the German versions anyway, so they wouldn't be exactly the same as in English.
slyboyseth Featured By Owner Feb 14, 2013  Student Writer
Wow, not even the people of NERV have these people beat-- *remembers Rebuild 3.0* Ohp. No. Wait. They're the same.
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